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August 17, 2019, 11:21:46 pm

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auds

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Indo Advice
« on: January 02, 2014, 10:16:29 pm »
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Hi there :) Just wanted to share some of the things that I did with my Indo studies in 2013. Hopefully they will be of some use to you

READING
PRACTICING: Go through the reading materials your teachers give you and the reading exercises in your workbook. For additional practice, go onto an Indo news sites (like Kompas) and read/translate your way through an article. Try and pick current topics as well (As it can give you an idea for your detailed study topic later on). Personally though, my reading was one of my stronger points so I didn't practice much on it. I just finished the reading materials given to me + the workbook exercises.

DURING SAC/EXAM: Look at the questions and read through the article as a whole first to get a general idea of what is happening (This is during reading time). Note words you don't know, but don't stress too much over it. Also, try not to copy and paste the text whilst answering questions (which is easily done when responding in Indo). It's always better to slightly reword the answer with your own words! (scores you more marks apparently)

My strategy for reading:
1. Read the questions
2. Read the article
3. Try and note where the answers were located within the article (e.g. if question 1 was answered in the first paragraph, I wrote a 1 and circled it next to that sentence)
4. Finally, answer the questions

LISTENING
PRACTICING: You can watch the Indo news (either online or on one of the SBS channels at 6 or 7 AM). You don't have to watch the whole thing either, just pick out one report and try to pick out what they're saying as well as what the overall message/content of the report is. If your parents are Indo/Malay, and they have time, ask them to sit down and watch it with you so you can ask them something you don't understand. Obviously, the more you listen the better. Try to do at least one listening exercise a week.

DURING SAC/EXAM: It's similar with reading.
1. Read the question and understand what it's asking
2. Listen to the tape the first time and jot EVERYTHING you hear whilst simultaneously trying to understand what's going on. Try and come up with short notations as well to make jotting down much easier (e.g. untuk = /u)
3. (in the break between the first and second replay) Answer as much as you can. If you're unsure about an answer, DON'T write it down because you can just confirm it when you hear the second time.
4. Listen 2nd time --> answer all the questions

SPEAKING
PRACTICING: If you know anyone who is Indo/Malay or who is studying it, try to converse with them in Indo as much as possible !!! (If you're Indo/Malay though, avoid speaking Indo slang or Malay words) Aside from that, start on your answers to your general conversation questions early - if possible, in 1st term have them down. That way you can just practice them and have them in your head before you start the next part,,, detailed study.

DURING SAC/EXAM: So I'm not quite sure how your teacher will do your SACs, might be a bit different to mine. I'll just write about what I did to prepare for the exam instead. As you would know, oral exam has the general conversation and detailed study

In terms of detailed study, make sure you pick a good topic! I suggest one where you can have your own opinions and solutions. You also want to be able to make comparisons to Australia. I've been told by my teacher that it's been advised that students do not pick religion-based topics because they are purely factual and informative, and it is quite difficult to put out your own opinion. Also, whilst doing early research will be extremely beneficial, don't feel pressured to fully complete your detailed study very early on in the year.  I did most of mine in the Term 2 holidays and Term 3 period :) However in saying that, I had a huge advantage as a Year 11 doing Indo 3/4, as I had much more time than my peers. I know on other language boards, people have been advised to have completed their detailed study and general conversation around the Term 2/3 period. So really, it depends on your subject load, how confident you are with memorizing what you've written and truly understanding and comprehending that finer details and points of the issue you will be discussing.

For all your answers, you want to end with a bait for the examiners to ask you the next question that you want them to ask. That way, you are essentially "controlling" the conversation. For example, if they asked you about your subjects, you could list them out, maybe mention your favourite subject and then talk about how these subjects are going to help you get into the course you want to do in Uni or maybe how they inspired your career choice etc. Hopefully then, they'll want to ask you more about this career or Uni course.

Don't reply examiners with one-line answers unless it's a really simple question, like "How is the weather today?". Basically, elaborate your answers whenever possible. If they ask you about what Uni course you want to get into, don't just say "Saya ingin berkuliah di Universitas ________ di bidang ________". Go into more details about it, like why you picked this course, maybe if it's difficult to get into etc.

WRITING
PRACTICING: Well initially I'd recommend you find out what your strengths are out of the 5 writing styles (evaluative, informative, persuasive, personal and imaginative). For me, I knew that I would never touch an imaginative short story EVER, so I didn't really do much on it. But I was good at the informative/evaluative/persuasive articles & speeches so I focused on that. Practice on topics like student exchange & learning Indonesian as they tend to pop up more. Just find your strengths and focus on them, but don't neglect the other ones as well. I'd recommend writing an essay every 1-3 weeks, and then hounding your teacher to correct it for you and give you constructive feedback. Obviously, as the time for a Writing SAC or the final exam draws near, you want to be writing much more essays, so that you can practise more, and get a better feel for timing, as well as weaving sentences together with sophisticated vocabulary and grammatical structures that make sense.

Try and memorize a few Indo sayings as it really enhances your writing ! For me I just remembered "di mana ada kemauan, di situ ada jalan" dan "ada banyak jalan ke Roma". The way to introduce it into your writing is --> seperti pepatah yang mengatakan bahwa (insert saying here), (insert explanation here) <--- Hopefully your teacher will explain this. Aim to use a wide variety of grammer - when you're looking over your work, go through the grammar booklet and ask yourself "Have I put in a ke-an, ter-, me-kan, me-, me-i..." and so forth. Try and put in as many as possible ! You want to impress the examiner - so show off your expansive knowledge of Indonesian grammar and vocabulary.

DURING SAC/EXAM: Make sure you're confident with the text type (e.g. diary entry, speech, article) and text style (e.g. evaluative, personal). I've been told that you should always put a title on your work, regardless of what text type it is. To be safe, I just did that anyway.

EXAM GUIDELINE
Here was my exam strategy :)
1. Look at the writing topics and quickly pick the one that I was comfortable with. Do not try to plan it just yet.
2. Read the listening questions and understand them thoroughly
3. Skim over the reading articles (if I had time)  as well as look at the questions for it.
4. Proceed to do the exam.

ALWAYS check what language you need to write in - you don't want to get a zero just for writing in the wrong language... that would just be depressing. Personally after the listening finished, I liked to do reading and then writing. But different people like to do it in different ways.

So hopefully what I outlined up there helped a bit :) Please don't feel too discouraged if you feel like you're not doing well at the moment, whether it be in Unit 1/2 or 3/4. For my first Unit 1/2 SAC, I only scored a 12/20! Similarly with my first 3/4, I only managed a 15/20. You can and will definitely improve in your Indonesian language studies (and any another subject), if you work hard and put in the effort :) Remember, improvement in languages takes time and effort, so just do your best and practise consistently!

Always ask your teacher if you need help with anything, I'm sure they'll be more than happy to help :) Thanks for taking the time to read this.

Semoga sukses untuk pelajaraanmu dalam Bahasa Indonesia !!! :)
« Last Edit: February 02, 2015, 10:53:23 pm by auds »
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M_BONG

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Re: Indo Advice/Tips
« Reply #1 on: January 06, 2014, 07:28:38 pm »
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Hi Auds,

Terima Kasih banyak atas nasihatmu!

I was just wondering what topic you chose for your oral detailed study? I was told by my teacher that VCAA Oral examiners (particularly Indo ones) have a strong interest in politics so I shouldn't choose political detailed studies in fear of complicated questions being asked in the oral exam. Do you feel that is true?

I was looking into masalah pengotoran air terhadap masyarakat di Indonesia, but I fear that this topic is too broad. I wanted to do hukuman mati but was deterred, due to the remarks of my teacher. What do you think? Was your chosen topic easy for you?


Also, how did you tackle with the listening components of the VCAA exam? I am not an Indo. native so I can't catch accents or when the speakers are speaking fast and you only get to hear the listening part twice so I am most worried.  Did you encounter any questions during your exam which you didn't understand/catch from the listening part?  I was told by my teacher to 'predict' during reading time the likely answers to the listening parts before listening to it or 'guess' answers if you aren't sure/don't understand; do you think that is a good idea?
« Last Edit: January 06, 2014, 07:32:43 pm by Zezima. »

auds

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Re: Indo Advice/Tips
« Reply #2 on: January 06, 2014, 09:23:02 pm »
+1


Also, how did you tackle with the listening components of the VCAA exam? I am not an Indo. native so I can't catch accents or when the speakers are speaking fast and you only get to hear the listening part twice so I am most worried.  Did you encounter any questions during your exam which you didn't understand/catch from the listening part?  I was told by my teacher to 'predict' during reading time the likely answers to the listening parts before listening to it or 'guess' answers if you aren't sure/don't understand; do you think that is a good idea?

For the exam, I looked at the questions first and then when I was listening, I wrote down everything I could, especially points that I thought were relevant to the questions. If they were saying things like "apa kabar" or useless, irrelevant things, I didn't bother. Also, I wrote in Indonesian for both parts so when I translated to English, I didn't lose the proper meaning of the word (if that makes sense). What your teacher said is a good idea, when you read the questions you do get a general idea of what the answer will look like (maybe not the details), and that general idea helps you deem what is important to write down.

If you are worried about your listening, the only thing you can do is just to keep on listening to people speak Indo and listen to some Indo listening resources, unfortunately there is no other way to improve it. I recommend asking your teacher for additional listening resources (for e.g. those from your workbook), and perhaps listening to the Indo news ??? There are also apps that have international radio available for streaming (unfortunately the name escapes me, but I'm sure you can Google it)
« Last Edit: July 17, 2014, 08:02:11 pm by auds »
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Re: Indo Advice/Tips
« Reply #3 on: January 07, 2014, 12:23:23 am »
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Wow. Thanks heaps for the lengthy reply! :)

Another problem I constantly face in Indo is not being aware of grammar rules.
For instance, the most common one is not knowing the difference between when to use the "i" and "kan" suffix.

Eg. Why is it "mengurangi" not "mengurangkan".
Why is it "mendorongkan" not "mendorongi"

Is there a particular set of grammar rules that can be applied to determine the above?

Also, do you suggest in memorising the "me- prefix" table which goes something like this:

"If the base word starts with l , m , n , r etc the me- prefix is used for a verb;
If the base word starts with 'd , j , c , t" the men- prefix is used for a verb"


I understand you're not a teacher, but you sound knowledgable in the language and I currently don't have access to one so I would appreciate your help!

auds

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Re: Indo Advice/Tips
« Reply #4 on: January 07, 2014, 01:39:12 pm »
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Another problem I constantly face in Indo is not being aware of grammar rules.
For instance, the most common one is not knowing the difference between when to use the "i" and "kan" suffix.

Eg. Why is it "mengurangi" not "mengurangkan".
Why is it "mendorongkan" not "mendorongi"

Is there a particular set of grammar rules that can be applied to determine the above?



Imo, grammar is something that you just get a feel for by writing alot. It does help if you learn the various functions of prefixes and suffixes though. Personally, I didn't memorize the functions of each prefix & suffix because I was quite good at determining when it was appropriate. I only memorized it like one week before the exam because there's always a 1-mark exam question that asks you the function of a particular grammar thing.

Specifically for me-i & me-kan. IF I remember correctly:

--- the "i" suffix is used for when the subject is moving toward the object

e.g. saya akan mengunjungi indonesia. <--- in this case, I (the subject) am going to visit Indonesia (the object). it is me the subject that is moving toward the object.

--- the "kan" suffix is used for when the verb is acting upon the object.

e.g. pemerintah akan menjalankan program itu tahun depan. <-- in this case, the government (the subject) is running the program (the object next year). in this case, it is the object "moving" or doing the verb, so to speak.

^idk if that makes sense. Sorry if it doesn't, I'm not very clear on grammar rules haha. Also I'm not 100% sure if that's correct, so please don't take my word for it and instead, check with your teacher when school starts.

« Last Edit: July 17, 2014, 08:04:17 pm by auds »
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Re: Indo Advice/Tips
« Reply #5 on: January 07, 2014, 03:21:52 pm »
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hmm, grammar is something that you just get a feel for by writing alot. it does help if you learn the various functions of prefixes and suffixes though. personally, i didn't memorize the functions of each prefix & suffix because i was already really good at determining when it was appropriate. i only memorized it like one week before the exam because there's always a 1-mark exam question that asks you the function of a particular grammar thing.

specifically for me-i & me-kan. IF i remember correctly:

--- the "i" suffix is used for when the subject is moving toward the object

e.g. saya akan mengunjungi indonesia. <--- in this case, I (the subject) am going to visit Indonesia (the object). it is me the subject that is moving toward the object.

--- the "kan" suffix is used for when the verb is acting upon the object.

e.g. pemerintah akan menjalankan program itu tahun depan. <-- in this case, the government (the subject) is running the program (the object next year). in this case, it is the object "moving" or doing the verb, so to speak.

^idk if that makes sense. sorry if it doesn't, i'm not very clear on grammar rules haha. also i'm not 100% sure if that's correct, so please don't take my word for it and instead, check with your teacher when school starts xD


Thanks heaps! Yup, that is the way I understand it.

But I guess my broader question is how do you know which one to use and which one exists, not what happens when they are used? (If that makes sense?)

Like I know, when I use the word "melindungi" the subject moves but how do I know that the "-i' suffix must be used for the base word "lindung"? In this instance, f I use the "-kan" suffix, the word becomes "melindungkan" and that word doesn't exist....


auds

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Re: Indo Advice/Tips
« Reply #6 on: January 07, 2014, 05:44:42 pm »
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Thanks heaps! Yup, that is the way I understand it.

But I guess my broader question is how do you know which one to use and which one exists, not what happens when they are used? (If that makes sense?)

Like I know, when I use the word "melindungi" the subject moves but how do I know that the "-i' suffix must be used for the base word "lindung"? In this instance, f I use the "-kan" suffix, the word becomes "melindungkan" and that word doesn't exist....

Oh right, apologies for misinterpreting your question ^^" I don't think there is a set formula that lets you know which ones exist. For me, if the word doesn't exist, then it just sounds wrong when I use it LOL. I guess you get used to it and will be able to tell if it exists or doesn't exist after using those kind of words alot etc. (if you get what I mean)

 In terms of which one to use, it's basically like what happens when they are used. If the subject is moving, then you use the "i" and if the object is moving, use the "kan". You look at what is happening in your sentence and then determine which one to use?? Sorta like that, idk if that made sense as well.

^Did I answer your question? Let me know if I didn't LOL. :P
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MrsNicoleB

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Re: Indo Advice/Tips
« Reply #7 on: February 11, 2014, 01:15:48 pm »
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RE: meN-i vs meN-kan
Sometimes you just have to learn what to use - I mean, learn the individual me-i and me-kan words.  When in doubt, check the dictionary to see whether it exists!  There's a lot of different explanations to help you choose which one to use - but there's definitely not a one size fits all explanation, and sometimes the sheer number of explanations can just be confusing.

RE: memorizing the meN- table - I don't recommend this to my students.  Once you know lots of base words and what they change too it becomes second nature. Go through the alphabet - try to think of a simple verb for every letter.  That way you'll have an example to compare the new word to e.g. antar, beri, curi, dapat, erat dll.

RE: Listening in exam.  Listen to some of the past exams, they're on-line.  You'll probably find that they're much easier than most of the stuff you use in class!  By the time you get to the end of the year, you'll find that they're of a good pace, have no background noise (unlike some things used in class), and the speakers have a clear accent.  Your teacher gave you good advice to predict and guess if needed - always write something down!

I am a teacher btw...

M_BONG

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Re: Indo Advice/Tips
« Reply #8 on: April 21, 2014, 12:33:26 pm »
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Uploaded some sample essays in the original post :)

EDIT: Please PM me if you would like me to send a specific text type and style, I'd be happy to search my Indo folder for one :)

Brilliant! Terima Kasih banyak; we genuinely need someone like you on here considering the inactivity of the Indo board. :)

Do you have an example of your Oral/Detailed Study? I am doing Pencemaran Udara at my school; so not sure if you have that?

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Re: Indo Advice/Tips
« Reply #9 on: April 21, 2014, 07:29:01 pm »
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Yeah you're right.. the thing is less than 1,000 students do Yr 12 SL Indo each year; and very few non-natives do it :(  Declining figures in LOTE are really worrying tbh.

Anyways, we haven't got a sub-topic yet? What's a subtopic? I thought lingkungan is the main topic; and pencemaran udara is the sub-topic?

Love the attachment! Thanks so much :)

EDIT: Just read the attachment. WOW you're vocab is so good. Are you native? Btw, do you think for a non-native like myself, I shouldn't risk putting big words? Since if I put big words, the examiners will reply in big words and I would screw up? Thanks!
« Last Edit: April 21, 2014, 08:09:12 pm by Yhprum »

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Re: Indo Advice/Tips
« Reply #10 on: April 21, 2014, 08:47:14 pm »
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Agreed, especially when our society is placing increasing importance on international relationships and multilingual capabilities x_x"

Oh, I meant like a main focus on pencemaran udara (for e.g. pencemaran udara that is caused by 1. pabrik-pabrik 2. rokok 3. angkutan <-- well perhaps not that specific). Like for me, these were the three main points I focused on:

Pertama-tama saya ingin membicarakan tentang alasan-alasan mengapa jumlah perokok remaja dan anak-anak semakin meningkat di Indonesia. Kedua adalah kesulitan-kesulitan yang dihadapi perokok dalam usaha mereka untuk berhenti merokok. Yang terkahir adalah tindakan yang bisa dilaksanakan oleh pemerintah dan masyarakat Indonesia dalam menanggulangi masalah ini. (copied straight from my one-minute intro)

Oh oops our teacher has only asked us to focus on the broader issue of pencemaran udara. Maybe we will focus on a sub-topic like pabrik-pabrik when school starts.


Thanks for all the advice btw, will take them all on-board :)

auds

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Re: Indo Advice/Tips
« Reply #11 on: May 14, 2014, 02:48:42 pm »
+1


EDIT: Just read the attachment. WOW you're vocab is so good. Are you native? Btw, do you think for a non-native like myself, I shouldn't risk putting big words? Since if I put big words, the examiners will reply in big words and I would screw up? Thanks!

I believe the most important thing in vocabulary is understanding what it means. If you don't understand a word, don't use it. It's much better to have simple sentences that make sense then a whole load of sophisticated gibberish. In my opinion, as long as you understand what that 'big' word means, and know how to weave it into sentences correctly, then I don't see why you shouldn't use it. Given that you have so much time to prepare for oral exam, I don't think that would be a problem (in terms of understanding). So I say, go for it!

Even if they did use a big word in response to whatever you have said (big words or not), you can always clarify and ask what they mean in several ways:
  • Maaf, Bu/Pak, bisa tolong menjeleskan pertanyaan Bu/Pak?  <-- Could you please explain your question?
  • Maaf, Bu/Pak, bisa tolong menjeleskan artinya kosa kata "(insert word you don't understand here)"? <-- Could you please explain the meaning of the word "__________"
« Last Edit: July 15, 2014, 10:45:07 pm by auds »
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Re: Indo Advice/Tips
« Reply #12 on: May 18, 2014, 11:02:20 pm »
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Sigh...

I just had my Oral SAC yesterday and got one mark docked because I said "Bagaimana kalau saya terhilang di pusat kota" instead of "tersesat".....
And I said "Saya pasti Bahasa Indonesianya akan dilancarkan" when it's supposed to be "diperlancar"...

The thing is most people got 20/20 and I got 19/20 :( Bottom-ranked now. Saya ingin menanggis sekarang :(

Anyways, your advice is very helpful indeed! Just hope luck goes my way on the actual VCAA Oral exam where I don't make a grammar mistake... (like come on how am I supposed to know dilancarkan isn't grammatically correct...) haha. Enough of a whinge!

Oh dear, that just sounds harsh. The fact that you got 19/20 is still very impressive ! Not to worry though, there are still a few SACs to come, so you can definitely pull up your ranking :) In my personal opinion (I can't actually speak for any examiners), I feel like if your content and your fluency is so amazingly mind-blowing in the oral exam, they'll won't focus so much on the nitty gritty grammar mistakes that you make. I still remember that I started my first four responses with "Sesungguhnya....", and then proceeded to use no object-construction sentences during my oral exam, lol. But I was able to respond to the examiners' questions fluently, so I suppose that brought my mark up.
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Re: Indo Advice/Tips
« Reply #13 on: June 16, 2014, 01:54:56 am »
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Auds that's a very comprehensive description for tackling yr 12 indo. I'm sure that's a lot of help to all those studying unit 3/4. Good to see there's someone who can help out the up and coming indo students
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Re: Indo Advice/Tips
« Reply #14 on: June 26, 2014, 11:12:51 pm »
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Auds that's a very comprehensive description for tackling yr 12 indo. I'm sure that's a lot of help to all those studying unit 3/4. Good to see there's someone who can help out the up and coming indo students

Thank you swoop! Glad to help the rare few who are taking Indo :P
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