Does going to a private school make you get a better atar?

[M_BONG]

The problem with these public vs private school debates is that they tend to fall down to stereotypes claiming to be the truth about education. And that is where the discussion often always breaks down, eg.:

What more often is the case from what I've seen at my own school is that parents who are wealthy send their kids (often spoiled and couldn't give a stuff about education) to the private school where they do the minimum amount of work possible and scrape by without ACTUALLY trying in any real manner.

To be honest though, it depends on which school you go to (eg. the socioeconomic background of the area, the people there etc.). For every Melbourne Grammar there is another struggling private school. For every spoiled brat at a private school, there is another hardworking student who is not noticed because the stereotype doesn't allow it. Also, not all private schools have swimming pools, awesome facilities etc. many struggle with enrolment figures. So your education and ultimately your ATAR, as said by everyone else here, is what you make of it tbh.

[Chazef]

I think that up to a point, the average quality of teacher is just not very good, until you get to some elite private schools. I don't think resources make that much of a difference either because at the end of the day the only resources you need are the textbooks that you buy and a computer. I think the big difference is the students because with private schools regardless of their quality, your parents are paying lots of money for you to succeed so there's a greater pressure on you to not be a lazy/disruptive student. I didn't like my catholic (so semi-private) school at all but the nearby public schools had a reputation for hosting some absolute 'dropkick' students and I think people like that are just more likely to show up at a public school due to maybe difficult upbringings in low-socioeconomic families or being kicked out of a private school or something like that. Every school has good and bad students but I think public schools have a higher frequency of really disruptive students and that not only makes it hard for people to study but it establishes a culture where grades aren't very important socially.

I've made lots of outrageous assumptions here but I'm just stating what I've observed so I'm happy for somebody to school me on this

[DJA]

The problem with these public vs private school debates is that they tend to fall down to stereotypes claiming to be the truth about education. And that is where the discussion often always breaks down, eg.:
To be honest though, it depends on which school you go to (eg. the socioeconomic background of the area, the people there etc.). For every Melbourne Grammar there is another struggling private school. For every spoiled brat at a private school, there is another hardworking student who is not noticed because the stereotype doesn't allow it. Also, not all private schools have swimming pools, awesome facilities etc. many struggle with enrolment figures. So your education and ultimately your ATAR, as said by everyone else here, is what you make of it tbh.

Yeah fair call - Note I'm talking about the majority of private schools as generally more wealthy/better resources etc in comparison.

I just think that's its a flawed logic to attribute the paying of more money to a private school as corresponding with a 'greater' drive to succeed in VCE. That's a fallacy imo - hence the use of the gross stereotype to exaggerate it.

I'm obviously not saying every student is like that - its simply that there is a percentage of students who are in a 'well-off' public school who are. Hence you can't use socio-economic factors to justify more or less motivation to succeed in VCE.

Does that make sense?

[simba]

Hmm haven't read the other posts so sorry if it's already been said.

I don't believe it makes you get a better ATAR in terms of scaling. I went to a school ranked about 400th in the state, which made it really easy to get rank 1 in the SAC's for all my subjects. So the scaling from other classmates didn't really have any effect on my overall scores

[ShortBlackChick]

The gist of this article can be generally said as a fact, but as said above, at an individual level it depends on the circumstances. http://theconversation.com/australian-schools-engines-of-inequality-23979

[Hannibal]

I feel like the average private school would motivate an average student more than an average public school, with more individualistic style teaching, a more friendly vibe and less of a 'loose nature' floating about the school.

[Crystall97]

All in all, your ATAR will depend on the effort you give and nothing else. One does not simply buy an ATAR by enrolling at the most prestigious private school. As long as you are working hard to achieve your goals, reality is you will meet them.

Keep on mind all public schools are different, not just in their academic standards but the extra classes and activities offered. Personally I attend a little rural school with maybe 100-150 students in years 11 &12. By Victorian rankings we are scores very poorly, (300-400ish) but the extras outweigh this. We each are allocated our own mentor who is a member of the teaching staff. Each mentor looks after three students only, so it is a personalised experience. Class sizes are generally ten or less people, but more in the vet courses. Whilst not every year we get scorers of 99.95 most years the dux still exceeds 99.5.

Don't judge a public school by its ranking. Some will be much better schools than you could imagine.

[Frozone]

I feel like the average private school would motivate an average student more than an average public school, with more individualistic style teaching, a more friendly vibe and less of a 'loose nature' floating about the school.

True motivation(the one that will last) comes from within!

[Hannibal]

True motivation(the one that will last) comes from within!

Yep, I'm not trying to dispute that. But external motivation for the average Bob is better than no motivation at all .

[Russ]

I think too many people conflate "is it possible to get a good ATAR at a public school" with "is it harder to get a good ATAR at a public school".

You can talk about motivation and personal drive but that's a separate issue. I can see a large number of reasons why it's easier to get higher scores at a private school than a public school and very few reasons why that statement would not be true. There's a reason why sorting by median study score clumps all the private schools at the top of the list and it's not just 'bias'.

[SKGUN11]

Same Australian curriculum. Private schools just have better discipline and resources.

[dyskontent]

I just think that's its a flawed logic to attribute the paying of more money to a private school as corresponding with a 'greater' drive to succeed in VCE. That's a fallacy imo - hence the use of the gross stereotype to exaggerate it.

I agree with this to some extent, while you aren't paying for a greater 'drive', what you are paying for is a better learning culture. Most of the big wealthy private schools (Scotch, Grammar, PLC, MLC etc) carry a culture where the students want to do well, where even the 'jocks' make an effort, especially during VCE. Students at private schools don't really think about how they have to do well since their parents are paying alot, rather, since their parents are more likely to place a focus on education, these students are raised in an environment where they are encouraged to do well.

You can see this reflected in other non academic areas such as sport - why do so many of the elite AFL players come from private schools? It's because the parents / staff / other students encourage a culture of performing at your best.

I don't think socio-economic status DIRECTLY affects how well a school performs, especially since the stereotype of everyone at private schools being extremely wealthy is an exaggerated falsehood. What allows the top private (and public) schools to succeed year after year is a continuous belief throughout the school that doing well and working hard is something to strive for.

[thushan]

In fact, the jocks tend to be the highest achievers often! Eg - the captain of our school cricket and AFL teams also got two 50s, and a former cricket captain was also a school vice captain and topped the state in a subject.

[Frozone]

You can see this reflected in other non academic areas such as sport - why do so many of the elite AFL players come from private schools? It's because the parents / staff / other students encourage a culture of performing at your best.

And they give sports scholarships and have superb facilities.

[notveryasian]

Given the resources of some public schools they might not be able to teach certain subjects and this may have an impact on your performance if you aren't given as many choices in your VCE.

But overall, as many people have said already, it's mainly comes down to the individual and their own desire to do well.