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Author Topic: VCE Biology Question Thread  (Read 3608850 times)  Share 

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vox nihili

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Re: VCE Biology Question Thread
« Reply #11490 on: December 21, 2018, 10:10:06 pm »
+6
This has been a really great discussion. I'm really pleased with the contributions here. Please don't feel overwhelmed if you think this is way beyond expectations; it has been! You shouldn't really have to worry about protein folding, other than to have a basic understanding that it happens and, perhaps, have an understanding that there are organelles that help it along.
Your definitions of levels of structure don't need to reference the kind of bonding, but Erutepa is quite right about the distinction in levels of structure. This is certainly a more correct definition, but not one that is needed in VCE unfortunately!

I'm going to add some thoughts now. They all stray out of the course, so jog on if you don't want to worry yourself.



The way a protein folds is determined by a lot of different factors. The most critical factor is the primary structure of the protein. This is the amino acids that make up the protein. For a VCE level definition, this is all you really need to concern yourself with. It is quite right, even beyond VCE, to assume the primacy of the primary structure as the determinant of a protein's topography (fancy way of saying the way it is shaped/folded).
The configuration of a protein also depends on other factors, however. We already know this inherently in VCE. Proteins that are denatured (high or low pH, high temperature etc) effectively unfold. Therefore the tertiary structure of a protein is influenced by its environment.
Chaperones were mentioned earlier. These are proteins that basically help proteins fold properly, in the same way a parent might help to dress their child. In many cases, proteins will simply not fold in the right configuration if not for a chaperone. This is because there are different ways that a protein might fold, even in the same environment (but the cell wants it to fold in a particular way, so chaperones help it alone). Lots of these chaperones exist in the ER, which is something that we've heard mentioned here a bit. Lots of proteins get folded in the ER, mainly because of the abundance of chaperones but also because the conditions are really good for folding, too. These chaperones also exist in the cytoplasm, but their influence isn't quite as strong there, mainly because the environment can't be controlled as strictly and the chance of a nascent (fancy way of saying new) protein bumping into a chaperone is a lot lower, because the cytoplasm is so much larger than the ER. This makes protein folding in bacteria (i.e. prokaryotes) a little bit tricky, because they don't have an ER. For the most part they get by having chaperones cruise around the cytoplasm and help to fold, but as it happens, gram negative bacteria (those with two membranes) actually have a specialised space called the periplasm between their membranes where they send new proteins to fold. The environment in there is really good for protein folding and chock full of chaperones. (as an interesting aside, sometimes when we try to make human proteins with bacteria which actually have to add a tag to the protein that sends it to the periplasm to be folded properly!).

All right, that's enough protein fun.  Almost got onto folding funnels and energies and shit but this is already way too much!
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DBA-144

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Re: VCE Biology Question Thread
« Reply #11491 on: December 22, 2018, 02:11:29 pm »
+1
Snip


Out of interest, would we possibly be able to produce an antibiotic that could target the periplasm you were talking about and interfere with the chaperone proteins there, or prevent proteins from reaching the periplasm, meaning that the gram negative bacterium would be unable to synthesise proteins that have their correct 3D functional shape? Ultimately, I believe that this would be able to kill off the bacteria? 
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vox nihili

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Re: VCE Biology Question Thread
« Reply #11492 on: December 22, 2018, 02:41:52 pm »
+1


Out of interest, would we possibly be able to produce an antibiotic that could target the periplasm you were talking about and interfere with the chaperone proteins there, or prevent proteins from reaching the periplasm, meaning that the gram negative bacterium would be unable to synthesise proteins that have their correct 3D functional shape? Ultimately, I believe that this would be able to kill off the bacteria? 

Very, very interesting thought indeed. Theoretically, yes.
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DBA-144

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Re: VCE Biology Question Thread
« Reply #11493 on: December 29, 2018, 09:27:20 pm »
0
Are histones regulatory or structural genes?
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PhoenixxFire

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Re: VCE Biology Question Thread
« Reply #11494 on: December 29, 2018, 09:44:13 pm »
+3
Are histones regulatory or structural genes?
Histones are proteins, not genes. They're not something you need to know about for 3/4 although you learn about them in 1/2.

I don't know if VCAA would consider them structural or regulatory proteins. It depends on what definition they're using, if they're using the definition of regulatory proteins as proteins that bind to specific regulatory sequences of DNA and therefore alter the rate of transcription of genes then they wouldn't be regulatory genes. Having said that, they sort of are involved in regulation because of their role in maintaining the structure of DNA, so it really depends on what definition VCAA uses.
« Last Edit: December 29, 2018, 09:50:04 pm by PhoenixxFire »
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DBA-144

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Re: VCE Biology Question Thread
« Reply #11495 on: December 29, 2018, 09:49:51 pm »
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Histones are proteins, not genes. They're not something you need to know about for 3/4 although you learn about them in 1/2.

I don't know if VCAA would consider them structural or regulatory proteins. It depends on what definition they're using, if they're using the definition of regulatory proteins as proteins that bind to specific regulatory sequences of DNA and therefore alter the rate of transcription of genes then they wouldn't be regulatory genes.


Oops silly me!

Under what circumstances would they be called regulatory genes then?

Also, what would be a good definition of structural and regulatory genes?

All I have is any gene not a structural gene is a regulatory gene and that structural genes are genes that encode for the production of products that make up a cell s strucutre.

Are these good?
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PhoenixxFire

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Re: VCE Biology Question Thread
« Reply #11496 on: December 29, 2018, 09:57:41 pm »
+3


Oops silly me!

Under what circumstances would they be called regulatory genes then?

Also, what would be a good definition of structural and regulatory genes?

All I have is any gene not a structural gene is a regulatory gene and that structural genes are genes that encode for the production of products that make up a cells structure.

Are these good?
Just edited my post to include that haha - they might be considered regulatory proteins because of their role in the structure of DNA, which is obviously pretty important for gene expression.

I wouldn't use that definition for structural genes - it's too narrow. Some (protein) enzymes, for example, are involved in respiration, they're structural proteins but aren't involved in cell structure.

The definitions I used were:
Structural genes: Encode gene products involved in cellular metabolism.
Regulatory genes: Encode gene products that regulate the expression of other genes.
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jacquii02

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Re: VCE Biology Question Thread
« Reply #11497 on: January 10, 2019, 11:32:32 pm »
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hi all, I was just wondering what concepts would be useful to revise over the holidays going into unit 1 of biology? I didn't do year 10 biology so I am a little lost in all the definitions.

Erutepa

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Re: VCE Biology Question Thread
« Reply #11498 on: January 10, 2019, 11:39:39 pm »
+1
hi all, I was just wondering what concepts would be useful to revise over the holidays going into unit 1 of biology? I didn't do year 10 biology so I am a little lost in all the definitions.
Hi,
I don't think skipping year 10 biology is all that big of a deal, so don't worry about it. You do a lot of the same things in year 10 as you do in year 11 anyway, so it's not like you have missed out on anything major.
I also don't think you need to worry about revising too much over the holidays and try to enjoy them - there is plenty of time to study hard in the years ahead. But if you just like studying or are super keen to get right into the course, then by all means do. I would just recommend skimming through your textbook (if you have one) and getting a rough idea of the course and the topics. If you do come across something that's a bit difficult and you don't understand some terminology, you are more than welcome to post it here and I'm sure someone will be able to lend some help.

Good luck and I hope this helps!
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PhoenixxFire

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Re: VCE Biology Question Thread
« Reply #11499 on: January 10, 2019, 11:57:54 pm »
+1
If you want to have a look at some topics then learning a bit about the plasma membrane/cellular respiration/photosynthesis/mitosis/meiosis is probably your best option. But definitely wouldn't recommend learning anything in detail, you'll just end up forgetting it anyway. If you're worried just search those topics in youtube and you'll find heaps of videos explaining them :)
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Sine

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Re: VCE Biology Question Thread
« Reply #11500 on: January 11, 2019, 12:15:18 am »
+2
hi all, I was just wondering what concepts would be useful to revise over the holidays going into unit 1 of biology? I didn't do year 10 biology so I am a little lost in all the definitions.
tbh I wouldn't go over anything in detail. Firstly because it's units 1/2 and you don't need to be too invested in it since it doesn't count towards your study score  (some aspects will flow to units 3/4 but for the most part it's only the general biology concepts that are existent in both courses). Obviously this might be a moot point if you aren't worried about scores but Also that the content assessed will vary between schools/teachers and there is no way in knowing until your teacher actually focuses on particular areas of study.

If you are just super keen to study something your best option would be to just learn whatever biology interests you to get you primed for the new year (or just do nothing and enjoy your summer holiday.

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Re: VCE Biology Question Thread
« Reply #11501 on: January 14, 2019, 12:58:30 pm »
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Can non-disjunction occur in the
- first OR second division of meiosis
- Both the first and second meiotic division?

I argued that it could occur in both, however my teacher says that it's the latter


Erutepa

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Re: VCE Biology Question Thread
« Reply #11502 on: January 14, 2019, 01:14:23 pm »
+1
Can non-disjunction occur in the
- first OR second division of meiosis
- Both the first and second meiotic division?

I argued that it could occur in both, however my teacher says that it's the latter

Erutepa did a no no and misinformed, so apologies to all.
My corrected response is as follows.
Non-disjunction is both the faluire of each chromosome of a homologous pair to separate in the first meiotic division, or the faluire of each sister chromatid of a chromosome to separate in the second meiotic division.
So non-disjunction can occur in both meiotic divisions  :)
« Last Edit: January 14, 2019, 03:19:25 pm by Erutepa »
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marangutan

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Re: VCE Biology Question Thread
« Reply #11503 on: January 14, 2019, 01:20:56 pm »
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Non-disjunction occurs when the sister chromatids of each chromosome do not correctly sperate. Sister chromatids are only separated in the second meiotic division, thus non-disjunction only occurs in the second meiotic division.
In the first meiotic division, each chromosome of a homologous pair are separated.
Just so I'm clear, you're saying that non disjunction only happens in the second meiotic division?

Erutepa

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Re: VCE Biology Question Thread
« Reply #11504 on: January 14, 2019, 01:30:05 pm »
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Just so I'm clear, you're saying that non disjunction only happens in the second meiotic division?
I just did some quick reading and reliase that I am wrong. Non-Disjunction can occur in both meiotic divisions.
I have edited my above response.
Very sorry
« Last Edit: January 14, 2019, 03:20:11 pm by Erutepa »
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