COVID-19

[The Cat In The Hat]

example?

Case in point: recovery from spinal surgery where the doctors say at least an hour's walking a day.

[K888]

Case in point: recovery from spinal surgery where the doctors say at least an hour's walking a day.

People under these circumstances would be liaising with their treating health professional to find a work around.
It could just be that they have to walk around their house for an hour or else their treating health professionals would figure out other forms of exercise if necessary.

[Lear]

Case in point: recovery from spinal surgery where the doctors say at least an hour's walking a day.

Most surgery involves some level of immunosuppression due to a few factors.  While I have 0 insight to this nor the knowledge to say this is  definitely true, it seems reasonable that healthcare professionals would be advising against these individuals from going far outside of home to exercise anyway during a pandemic.

It seems your ‘quite a lot of exercise’ isn’t very common anyway if spinal surgery is the first example that comes to mind.

In any case, delving into such particulars is really unhelpful. The rules that have been implemented aren’t aimed to consider every single individuals circumstances and possible exception. They are there to simplify what is expected of the public so there is less friction in following those rules. Absolutely there is still room for the very rare exceptions and you’d expect a big chunk of common sense to be applied when considering those. I just find it pointless going on about ‘well what about x’ huh?

[The Cat In The Hat]

It seems your ‘quite a lot of exercise’ isn’t very common anyway if spinal surgery is the first example that comes to mind.

It came to mind because it's the case I have... despite the surgery having been awhile ago (several months) I still need the daily exercise to help with recovery.
Point taken, though. Thanks.

[keltingmeith]

No, but as you said, people are ignoring the guidelines. If we continue to see any single form of authority as brutal, we're just givin a bad rep as a nation. That most of us don't give a crap about those who seriously place their health first. St*ff shit.

That's not what I said. I mean, I don't disagree with the fact- there are certainly people who are ignoring guidelines - but that's not what I said. And I'm going to be honest, I'm not even sure what you're trying to argue anymore?

All I was trying to say is that it's important for the Government to not take a totalitarian stance, because they'll lose the willingness of the nation. Sure, maybe 5% or so of people aren't interested in listening (and they may be loud, but I think you'll find they aren't as big as they sound - though time will tell, given that masks only became compulsory to wear today), but most people are - and if the Government took a totalitarian stance, they'd lose the support of the people and the proportion that do comply would start to go down. How the Government is currently handling the situation, I think is fine - there are guidelines in place. It's up for businesses to interpret how those guidelines are used, and for the individual to interpret them for their own safety. Police will fine people who don't comply in public, sure, but that's very different to living in a dictatorship.

[K888]

Was heartening to see everyone wearing masks today when I had to leave the house for an appointment. Restored a bit of my faith in people

[sweetiepi]

Was heartening to see everyone wearing masks today when I had to leave the house for an appointment. Restored a bit of my faith in people

Same goes with the tram and trains I've been on today! 😊 was surprised to see no noses poking out either 😅

[angrybiscuit]

Was heartening to see everyone wearing masks today when I had to leave the house for an appointment. Restored a bit of my faith in people

Was also pleasantly surprised to see the whole school nice and covered up

Reminder: Though masks are compulsory, this should not create a false sense of security or create complacency. Social distancing and staying at home when you can is still our best bet from slowing the spread and reducing the rate of transmission.

[brothanathan]

That's not what I said. I mean, I don't disagree with the fact- there are certainly people who are ignoring guidelines - but that's not what I said. And I'm going to be honest, I'm not even sure what you're trying to argue anymore?

Firstly, I can see why it's hard to sense someone's tone via text and just throwing comments around doesn't help.

Oh, here's what I was referring to:

The problem here isn't these people thinking about human rights or democracy, it's about them choosing to ignore guidelines that benefit the masses

Anyways.. I wasn't arguing anything in the first place. I feel sorry that you took it that way. To make my comments more inquisitive, what do you mean by the masses?

Sure, maybe 5% or so of people aren't interested in listening (and they may be loud, but I think you'll find they aren't as big as they sound - though time will tell, given that masks only became compulsory to wear today), but most people are

We'll see about that too.

Loving your input by the way 

[turinturambar]

For reference, exercise is one of the permitted reasons to leave your home when diagnosed with Covid-19 or when a close contact.  Surprised me, but the "Diagnosed Persons and Close Contacts Directions (No 7)" are quite clear: They must take reasonable steps to maintain 1.5 metre distancing, but it is a valid reason.  As a result I'd be extremely surprised if people who have taken a test are required to avoid exercise.  Actually, I'd expect that legally they are permitted to leave for any of the four reasons, and, while there is a recommendation that they remain on premises, I can't see them having stricter rules than people who have actually been diagnosed.

Of course, I am not recommending leaving your house between test and diagnosis or after diagnosis.  Whether legal or not, at minimum you would be laying yourself open to prosecution in the court of public opinion.  But when Dan Andrews talked today about fining people who were not present when someone turned up to present their positive test, I'm not sure I can see a basis in the directions for doing that (yet, anyway). The directions for diagnosed persons don't apply to them until a diagnosis has been delivered to them, and even if they did apply, those directions include reasons for leaving the house, including exercise.

OK, story time: I've said earlier in the thread that I am quite able to choose a time and place to walk where I will see no-one.  In March I had something, probably flu, that didn't really line up with the then talked about symptoms for Covid-19. As I hadn't returned from overseas, I wasn't eligible for testing, but the expectation was that I didn't have it.  On days when I felt I needed a walk and felt up to it, I took a walk.  And saw no-one.  I would have no problem with anyone waiting for a test result or diagnosed with Covid-19 doing the same, so long as they were suitably careful and it was permitted by the regulations (which currently it seems it is).  If health authorities don't want that to happen, they should change the regulations.

One other point: I noticed that today the National Cabinet reaffirmed that suppression, not elimination, was the goal.  Though their gold standard for suppression seems to be "no community transmission", which in practical terms is surely close to elimination?

[The Cat In The Hat]

Surely we should try and eliminate... otherwise isn't this just gonna keep on going and stop us from going overseas and whatever?
Thanks for the information, turin.
Hopefully yesterday's slight decrease is the beginning of the end... of COVID-19, not freedom .

[keltingmeith]

Firstly, I can see why it's hard to sense someone's tone via text and just throwing comments around doesn't help.

Oh, here's what I was referring to:
Anyways.. I wasn't arguing anything in the first place. I feel sorry that you took it that way. To make my comments more inquisitive, what do you mean by the masses?

We'll see about that too.

Loving your input by the way 

By masses, I mean the population at large - most people in the city.

Surely we should try and eliminate... otherwise isn't this just gonna keep on going and stop us from going overseas and whatever?
Thanks for the information, turin.
Hopefully yesterday's slight decrease is the beginning of the end... of COVID-19, not freedom .

Because elimination means a lot more than what you think it means, and it is way WAY harder to do and manage. You make the point that if we eliminate, we'd be able to go overseas a lot more easily - but that's just plain false. Elimination means that we'd have to hard lock our country from the outside world until COVID-19 is gone EVERYWHERE. Elimination would mean no opening borders, because opening borders would allow COVID to come back, and then we'd be back in hard lockdown to cause re-elimination.

However, if we aim for suppression, then once we've stopped the growth rate in the country, we can re-open the borders. Once we've removed community transmission, we can go back to allowing international travel and trade, and then just keep everything at stage 1 restrictions. Elimination would mean no restrictions, but it would also mean no outside world, which would COMPLETELY ruin the economy and isn't worth it.

Potentially, your idea of elimination is just what we're aiming for with suppression?

[K888]

More uplifting news: there have only been 36 deaths due to influenza in Australia this year, compared to 430 at the same time last year! School closures, social distancing and hand hygiene are contributors to the lower numbers of influenza, and the huge thing is 2 million more vaccines have been given than last year already!!
Take the wins where you can

[eloisegrace]

More uplifting news: there have only been 36 deaths due to influenza in Australia this year, compared to 430 at the same time last year! School closures, social distancing and hand hygiene are contributors to the lower numbers of influenza, and the huge thing is 2 million more vaccines have been given than last year already!!
Take the wins where you can

We love good news! I was talking to my dad about this driving to school and technically we have saved lives during this pandemic (or at least less people have died which is nice

[Sine]

Currently, there are 14.2 million confirmed cases and 600,000 deaths worldwide.

In terms of the world now there are 16.4 million confirmed cases and over 650,000 deaths.

In terms of Victoria, the biggest focus of today that I saw was that now elective surgeries (apart from category 1 and very urgent category 2) are being suspended in order to get medical staff into the private aged care facilities that have not been able to control the spread.