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Author Topic: Pathway/Bridging Course for Melbourne Uni Bachelor of Science?  (Read 5220 times)  Share 

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Theo1290

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Pathway/Bridging Course for Melbourne Uni Bachelor of Science?
« on: November 08, 2019, 01:58:59 am »
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Was looking to get into Melbourne Uni Bachelor of Science Computing and Software Systems. Well after today's math exam 2 I have the feeling I won't receive the 25ss prerequisite for maths methods...   

Honestly I have no idea about pathways or bridging courses. All I really put in my course application was the Melbourne course as my top preference and 7 random others relating to software in a random order; thinking I'll properly change them after the exams. But now I'm stuck, with Melbourne seeming unlikely  I have no idea what actual course or uni to choose, just whatever will let me transition quickest I suppose. I dread the idea of spending 3/4 years in one uni just to get into Melbourne from one thing I've heard.

I just found out about a bit more about bridging courses, apparently I can apply for Bachelor of Art at Melbourne and do some introduction to maths subject or some online course and then assuming I get a certain grade I can transition to Bachelor of Science? https://science.unimelb.edu.au/courses/frequently-asked-questions/science-prerequisites

Doesn't seem too bad but what does Bachelor of Arts even entail? I'm not exactly an "arts student." How long would I be stuck doing Bachelor of Arts, what would I be learning, at what point can I transfer to Bachelor of Science, is it actually preferable instead to finding a different uni and then transferring to Melbourne Uni later on?

In the link provided under " I DIDN’T STUDY MATHEMATICAL METHODS IN YEAR 12. WHAT CAN I DO?" (I'm assuming this also applies to people who did the course but didn't receive the study score" it shows other options like an online course, senior maths course via UniLearn, introduction subject to maths with CAP or do it with Bachelor of Arts or do it with Bachelor of Science at a different uni.  What's the difference between each of them, if say I choose to do the online course how do I apply, can I start Bachelor of Science immediately or do I do the course separately?

Honestly not sure how to make any of these decisions when I don't know the first thing about university life. A lot of university sites don't even properly explain pathways, just a bunch of nonsense about credit when the main things I want to know are: a) what courses at what universities will potentially allow me to transfer to this course later on and b) minimum amount of time I could be spending in the course.

Edit: Talked to my careers counselor who advised not to do a bridging course as it's typically for people who don't meet the atar requirement either. Told me to look at Deakin Uni Science as my last preference. (as it requires only English and is a backup if my maths ss is below raw 25, and even below a 20. Is this good advice?
« Last Edit: November 08, 2019, 10:07:46 pm by Theo1290 »

AngelWings

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Re: Pathway/Bridging Course for Melbourne Uni Bachelor of Science?
« Reply #1 on: November 08, 2019, 05:23:27 pm »
+13
Alright here we go, as promised... Fair warning, this is going to be a loooong post - so much so that I've put all my responses in spoilers for you. (Side note: Anyone who actually reads all of this, if I have anything inaccurate here, please feel free to correct me. It's entirely possible and I make mistakes sometimes.) For reference, I use the following abbreviations: BSci = Bachelor of Science, BA= Bachelor of Arts, UoM = University of Melbourne

But now I'm stuck, with Melbourne seeming unlikely
Spoiler
Probably wouldn't be too discouraged by this just yet. You may have done better than you thought. You never know. Would probably keep the Bachelor of Science (Computing and Software Systems) at UoM at Preference #1, if that's what you truly wanted to study, regardless of your situation. This link or this link might be helpful to explain why you should keep that there. (It's still mostly relevant in 2019.)

I have no idea what actual course or uni to choose, just whatever will let me transition quickest I suppose. I dread the idea of spending 3/4 years in one uni just to get into Melbourne from one thing I've heard.
Spoiler
You can transfer between any pair of semesters for the following semester e.g. you can apply for transfer and switch after your first semester of uni, if your transfer application is successful.

In terms of the quickest transfer, it'd be between the first and second semester in your first year of uni. Usually this transfer will still look at your ATAR and if you've done a maths unit equivalent to Methods, they may be able to credit that as passing the Methods raw 25SS prerequisite instead of having to take a bridging course - but I'd check with Melbourne Uni just in case. (I think it's the student course enquiries is called Stop 1 there, if my memory serves me correctly?) In all honesty, I don't know whether you'll need to pass the Methods prereq if you're doing a transfer, but that's another thing to ask Melbourne Uni. (Usually for these things, it's better to be safe than sorry.)
     
Doesn't seem too bad but what does Bachelor of Arts even entail?
Spoiler
Perhaps the most broad degree out there, it encompasses a lot of the humanities and social sciences. Arts covers anything from languages/ linguistics to philosophy to psychology/ social sciences. The full list of majors gives a small insight into the areas you could study, which can be found here.
 
I'm not exactly an "arts student." How long would I be stuck doing Bachelor of Arts, what would I be learning, at what point can I transfer to Bachelor of Science, is it actually preferable instead to finding a different uni and then transferring to Melbourne Uni later on?
Spoiler
Q: How long would I be stuck doing Bachelor of Arts? At what point can I transfer to Bachelor of Science?
A: See answer a couple of quotes ago. You can usually transfer between any given semester after the first one. Transfers during the first year of uni may involve your ATAR.

Q: What would I be learning?
A: It varies. Depends on the units (that's what uni students call subjects) you pick, what interests you, what your intended major would be if your transfer attempts fail, etc. etc.. Usually it mostly depends on the units you pick/ need that will dictate what you'll be learning. Finding the Handbook entry (basically the study design if we're using VCE as a comparison) may be more helpful in telling you what you'd be learning - that's effectively their curriculum at uni (with some give or take). Handbook entries for UoM can be found here, but you'd need to know what units/ areas you are intending to search up. Each unit will have their own types of classes and their own content dictated primarily by teaching staff.

Example: A philosophy unit may consist of one lecture and one seminar a week. Your homework for this unit may consist of a 2000 word essay on a given topic due at the end of the semester, a 15 page weekly reading and you may have a group assignment on ethics due in 2 weeks simultaneously.     

Q: Is it actually preferable instead to finding a different uni and then transferring to Melbourne Uni later on?
A: Usually, internal transfers (i.e. transferring between courses at the same institute e.g. BA at UoM --> BSci at UoM) are more successful than external transfers (i.e. transferring between courses at different institutes e.g. BSci at Monash --> BSci at UoM). This is because Melbourne Uni generally recognises its own units. If you take any UoM units and pass them, you'll get this thing called "credit". If you obtain enough credits, you'll be able to graduate (earlier). If you transfer internally (between UoM courses), then you'll be more likely to transfer some, if not all, of your credit over to the new degree - that's great, because then you can take less units to finish your degree and save some of your time and money. If you go to another uni, then try to transfer into UoM, UoM may not recognise some of the units you took, which means you'll have less of the credit transfer over when you finally get into the BSci at UoM and therefore you'll need to take more units to finish the degree, which means you'll need to spend more time and money. if you plan to do an external transfer, my usual advice is: always ask about credit transfer before you apply.
     

In the link provided under " I DIDN’T STUDY MATHEMATICAL METHODS IN YEAR 12. WHAT CAN I DO?" (I'm assuming this also applies to people who did the course but didn't receive the study score" it shows other options like an online course, senior maths course via UniLearn, introduction subject to maths with CAP or do it with Bachelor of Arts or do it with Bachelor of Science at a different uni.  What's the difference between each of them, if say I choose to do the online course how do I apply, can I start Bachelor of Science immediately or do I do the course separately?
Spoiler
If I were you, I'd probably ask Melbourne Uni about these options, but usually (i.e. take with a large grain of salt), it's something like this:
Options: Online Course and Senior Maths Course via UniLearn
These are usually the Diploma option at other unis. I'm not so sure if it applies to UoM. I seriously have zero knowledge about these, so you'll need to ask Melbourne Uni (or someone more knowledgeable) about these.

Option: Introduction subject to maths via CAP
I think this correlates to what this option is about. If my understanding is correct, you'll take the one unit of maths and then, if you pass the maths unit, you'll be able to enter the first year of the BSci at UoM the following semester/ year and apply for something called advanced standing (what that entails is usually a bunch of logistics to do with your academic transcript - the uni report card, effectively, and you might be able to do one less unit in the end if you play your cards right and if I interpreted that correctly).   

Option: Take maths unit with BA
Fairly self-explanatory. You start off by putting the BA at UoM as a VTAC preference (ideally Preference #2 or lower), get an offer for the BA, accept it. Take a maths unit equivalent to Methods that UoM accepts as a breadth unit (basically UoM's version of an elective subject) and pass, then attempt for transfer into the BSci. You'll need to be competitive enough upon transfer (usually via good uni grades, but may involve ATAR if in first year uni) to actually be successful. This option will mean that the majority of your units will be Arts (humanities) units until you successfully transfer out.
 
Option: Take a BSci at another uni
Again, another self-explanatory option. Put a preference down on VTAC for a BSci at another uni that doesn't have the same Methods prereq e.g. Monash, Deakin, etc. and then attempt external transfer. This option allows you to take some units that are closer/ related to computing and software systems, if you play your cards right, but has the risk of lowered chance of credit transfer and have the discrepancies between the unis playing against you (e.g. you may not have learnt exactly the same content as other computing students who have taken only UoM units). You'll need to be competitive enough upon transfer (usually via good uni grades, but may involve ATAR if in first year uni) to actually be successful in transferring. If you can't imagine studying anything other than computing and software systems, can find a BSci course that encompasses that area and don't mind the risk, then this might be a good option.

Honestly not sure how to make any of these decisions when I don't know the first thing about university life. A lot of university sites don't even properly explain pathways, just a bunch of nonsense about credit when the main things I want to know are: a) what courses at what universities will potentially allow me to transfer to this course later on and b) minimum amount of time I could be spending in the course.
Spoiler
To be honest, yeah, I get you. It probably seems like nonsense now, but credit's what you work for as a uni student, so it becomes the 'all-important' thing when it comes to progressing through the degree. Unfortunately, this is one of those things where it is a "you gotta contact somebody to get the full info" scenario.

The answer to (a) is generally any course UoM deems as acceptable/ equivalent (which could be basically any degree, but the best chances you have are courses that are similar in study area e.g. BSci at another institute, or another UoM course).

The answer to (b) is basically any time transfer applications are open (which is basically once a semester, usually in the latter half), which you'll have to do on your own accord. The shortest amount of time possible, if you don't have the Methods prereq, is one semester.   

Edit: Talked to my careers counselor who advised not to do a bridging course as it's typically for people who don't meet the atar requirement either. Told me to look at Deakin Uni Science as my last preference. (as it requires only English and is a backup if my maths ss is below raw 25, and even below a 20. Is this good advice?
Spoiler
It depends on what you value and how you see things.

If you can't imagine doing anything besides the BSci (Computing and Software Systems) at UoM, then bridging course is valid. It is, however, more common to see it as a pathway for those who don't make the ATAR requirement as well as the prereq, as your careers counsellor stated. (Doesn't make it any less valid, valuable or respected, though!)

Deakin Science is a possible option and preference. A positive is that it's generally quite practical and Deakin is a fairly respected uni (and often quite an employable one, if my memory serves me correctly). A negative is that it doesn't have strictly computing/ software systems as a major or area of study within it - most majors in this degree are directed towards biology at Deakin.
« Last Edit: November 08, 2019, 11:18:13 pm by AngelWings »
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Theo1290

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Re: Pathway/Bridging Course for Melbourne Uni Bachelor of Science?
« Reply #2 on: November 08, 2019, 10:00:57 pm »
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Thanks mate!

AngelWings

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Re: Pathway/Bridging Course for Melbourne Uni Bachelor of Science?
« Reply #3 on: November 08, 2019, 11:22:40 pm »
+2
Sorry about the delay. This was an especially long post, so I wanted to get all of post (spelling, grammar, formatting, etc.) correct. There may be some inaccuracies in the post and I may not make things super clear, so please let me know if you have any questions whatsoever, no matter how 'dumb' or 'minor' you think they are. 

Hope it helps! :)
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Theo1290

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Re: Pathway/Bridging Course for Melbourne Uni Bachelor of Science?
« Reply #4 on: November 10, 2019, 05:54:22 pm »
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Thanks a lot for your reply. I do have some additional questions.

1) I am aware to list my preferences in order of "preference"and not "what I think I will get into." That being said after my results are released there's 2 days to change them right? And study scores are non-negotiable from what I know, so if I get maths methods ss 24 for example and I want to get into a course with ss25 requirement, should I thus remove ss25 courses, or is there still a chance and I should keep them on my list?

2) I'm a bit unsure of where my atar comes into this. I'm confident I'll get roughly 78 atar, maybe higher, but I'm confused between "atar" and "atar selection rank." I'm considering going with the Bachelor Art course, and I see here: "https://study.unimelb.edu.au/find/courses/undergraduate/bachelor-of-arts/entry-requirements/" mininum atar is 85 but "72.25" is the lowest selection rank to which an offer was made. I get that my atar selection rank is my atar and a bunch of other factors (like seas application- I applied for category 1 and 3) but what if I just straight up get an atar that is lower than 85, do I still have a chance or no? I don't know if your atar selection rank is something that is included in the results that I'll get on 12 december, and if they'll consider my atar selection rank despite having an atar less than the "minimum atar required to be eligible for an offer" which is 85.

3) If I go the Bachelor Art track, I have to pick a subject equivalent to "Introduction to Mathematics (MAST10012)" which you said Melbourne Uni accepts as a breadth unit. I see Bachelor of Arts has "maths for economy" "accelerated maths" and "maths and statistics" as breadth units, how do I know which one Melbourne Uni accepts without having to ask them?

4) Leading from the previous question, it may be a bit presumptuous for me to ask you this, but as a mod of these forums do you know anyone I could ask that was in a similar predicament to me or just underwent the same/similar procedures to get into the course they want; and possibly have experience as a Melbourne Uni student. I've emailed Melbourne Uni about pathway options and detailed my situation, IIRC was promised an email within some days. It's been 2 weeks now not a single email, I've checked my junk folder and everything. Feel unsure trying to contact them again as they ask for your name and everything.

5) Why are bridging courses more common for those who don't make the atar requirement either? Would the student not then have to go to a different uni and do external transfer?, if they don't get the atar requirement for say Bachelor of Science, then how would they even get into Bachelor of Art. I'm more in favour of trying for Bachelor of Art and transferring after a semester, because it seems more preferable to spending potentially longer time elsewhere (especially Deakin if my ss is below even 20, as it's not only a bit far but I'm just not interested in anything biology related things or any of the other areas of study in their Bachelor of Science, either sounds boring or hard like Chemistry which I dropped end of Yr11 for that reason).

Once again thank you for your response.

Bri MT

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Re: Pathway/Bridging Course for Melbourne Uni Bachelor of Science?
« Reply #5 on: November 10, 2019, 08:04:51 pm »
+4
Not Angelwings but here's my attempt at quickly answering:

1. Study score requirements tend to be strict but if it's only by 1 or something I'd put it in anyway unless you've got something to lose by not having another slot available for preferences

2. You'd have a chance

3. Unless you happen to find someone who went through the approval process for with those units I'm pretty sure you'll need to ask.

4. I'd reply to your email to them politely bumping it. They likely get a lot of emails and yours may have been lost in the inbox

AngelWings

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Re: Pathway/Bridging Course for Melbourne Uni Bachelor of Science?
« Reply #6 on: November 10, 2019, 08:50:24 pm »
+5
1) I am aware to list my preferences in order of "preference"and not "what I think I will get into." That being said after my results are released there's 2 days to change them right?
Yes, there's usually a short period between ATAR Release Day and Change of Preference Deadline. Two days is correct. (VTAC Course Preferences close for December round at 4pm 14th December.)
And study scores are non-negotiable from what I know, so if I get maths methods ss 24 for example and I want to get into a course with ss25 requirement, should I thus remove ss25 courses, or is there still a chance and I should keep them on my list?
There's been a couple of super rare cases where people have been admitted with a 24 raw SS in a prereq subject (albeit usually with a fair bit of SEAS in their favour). If you discover that you have achieved a close to 25 raw SS and the Bachelor of Science (Computing and Software Systems) is still your top choice, I'd probably keep that as Preference #1 and make sure that you still have a few course preferences (so probably something like Preference #5-8 somewhere) that you have fulfilled the prereqs for.

2) I'm a bit unsure of where my atar comes into this. I'm confident I'll get roughly 78 atar, maybe higher, but I'm confused between "atar" and "atar selection rank." I'm considering going with the Bachelor Art course, and I see here: "https://study.unimelb.edu.au/find/courses/undergraduate/bachelor-of-arts/entry-requirements/" mininum atar is 85 but "72.25" is the lowest selection rank to which an offer was made. I get that my atar selection rank is my atar and a bunch of other factors (like seas application- I applied for category 1 and 3) but what if I just straight up get an atar that is lower than 85, do I still have a chance or no? I don't know if your atar selection rank is something that is included in the results that I'll get on 12 december, and if they'll consider my atar selection rank despite having an atar less than the "minimum atar required to be eligible for an offer" which is 85.
OK, so basically:
lowest ATAR required 2019 - the ATAR of the person with the lowest ATAR who was accepted into the BA in 2019 (i.e. they're in first year uni now). I always thought this was simply the ATAR only, but it looks like this includes adjustments including the Access Melbourne program.
lowest selection rank 2019 - the rough guide to the ATAR + all other adjustments (e.g. SEAS) for students accepted into the BA. This is the old "clearly-in ATAR" before the change to "selection ranks". People would often get ATARs below this and still be accepted, mostly due to adjustments.
minimum ATAR 2020 - a rough guide to the ATAR you'll have to achieve (excluding SEAS + any other adjustments) to get into the course. This is simply an estimate of the ATAR you'll need to be pretty comfortable that you'll get an offer for the BA at UoM, so it could be higher, it could be lower. Depends mostly on demand and if they have a spot for you or not.
Access Melbourne 2020 - If you are successful in your application for Access Melbourne (which usually means you ticked a box for the disadvantages listed here in your VTAC SEAS application), you'd be able to get guaranteed entry into the BA at UoM if you achieved a raw ATAR of 80.
but what if I just straight up get an atar that is lower than 85, do I still have a chance or no?
You will have a chance, if one or more of the following happen:
1. your adjustments make your selection rank above 85.00
2. UoM decide to offer you a place because there was a place available for you
Remember that there's more than one round of offers, so if you don't get it the first time, you might be able to get the offer the following round(s), although the chance of an offer becomes increasingly more slim with each round that passes.   

3) If I go the Bachelor Art track, I have to pick a subject equivalent to "Introduction to Mathematics (MAST10012)" which you said Melbourne Uni accepts as a breadth unit. I see Bachelor of Arts has "maths for economy" "accelerated maths" and "maths and statistics" as breadth units, how do I know which one Melbourne Uni accepts without having to ask them?
You will probably have to ask them in that case, unfortunately. A unit counts as a 'breadth unit' only if it's not within the Arts faculty, so if there's a maths unit within the Arts faculty, it'll count towards a major, minor or within faculty elective unit, depending on the rest of the units you've picked. Typically you'd also be able to read up on the handbook entries and see if any of it sounds like Methods/ MAST10012 equivalent content, but even then I'd double check with the student services (I think it's Stop 1) to be sure you've picked the right unit(s).

4) Leading from the previous question, it may be a bit presumptuous for me to ask you this, but as a mod of these forums do you know anyone I could ask that was in a similar predicament to me or just underwent the same/similar procedures to get into the course they want; and possibly have experience as a Melbourne Uni student.
I'm sure that there people out there who have but I can't think of anyone immediately, unfortunately. Sorry.
I've emailed Melbourne Uni about pathway options and detailed my situation, IIRC was promised an email within some days. It's been 2 weeks now not a single email, I've checked my junk folder and everything. Feel unsure trying to contact them again as they ask for your name and everything.
I've generally found calling via phone to be a more efficient use of my time for uni enquiries (at least at Monash). Not sure if that's helpful at all. Asking for your name is usually a uni policy thing, so it's likely to be an obligation on their part. Edit: politely bumping the email is also a great idea, if calling isn't your thing, as Bri has suggested.   

5) Why are bridging courses more common for those who don't make the atar requirement either?
Not entirely sure why, but that's what I've heard. I don't have a lot of experience with these things, so I can't say for sure.
Would the student not then have to go to a different uni and do external transfer?
Nope. Bridging courses are typically tied to the desired course or desired institute, so you'd usually complete and pass/ score well in the bridging course, and then be able to apply for the desired course. Best to ask UoM to confirm what I've said though - not 100% on what I've said is correct.

Note: Bri MT replied as I was typing. Pretty much was spot on what I was going to say. Will leave response here anyway. Reminder that you should take everything I have said with a grain of salt; I am not from UoM at all and may have inaccuracies in my posts.
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Theo1290

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Re: Pathway/Bridging Course for Melbourne Uni Bachelor of Science?
« Reply #7 on: November 12, 2019, 05:44:56 pm »
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Not Angelwings but here's my attempt at quickly answering:

1. Study score requirements tend to be strict but if it's only by 1 or something I'd put it in anyway unless you've got something to lose by not having another slot available for preferences

2. You'd have a chance

3. Unless you happen to find someone who went through the approval process for with those units I'm pretty sure you'll need to ask.

4. I'd reply to your email to them politely bumping it. They likely get a lot of emails and yours may have been lost in the inbox

Thanks for your answer! I had sent them an email through their submission/contact form, so I'm not sure if I can "bump" my email unfortunately.

And thank you again AngelWings! Yea I might try calling them instead.


Mod edit: You can reply to multiple people within one post by quoting several times and responding. We usually consider double, triple, etc. posting a bit like spam emails and we like to keep the forums free from spam. Hope you understand.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2019, 08:05:04 pm by AngelWings »