Login

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

April 25, 2024, 02:08:44 pm

Author Topic: Question..  (Read 1940 times)  Share 

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

hifer

  • Victorian
  • Trendsetter
  • **
  • Posts: 110
  • Respect: 0
Question..
« on: November 08, 2007, 02:31:45 pm »
0
Given f(x) = (x-1)^2 and g(x) = sqrt(x) + 1, find g(f(x))

Somehow the soln says that u can't simplify sqrt((x-1)^2) to just x-1 ? Why is that?

reg

  • Guest
Question..
« Reply #1 on: November 08, 2007, 02:37:23 pm »
0
Because sqrt is really +-. The full graph creates an absolute value graph, because you can't have a negative when you square something.

f(x) = sqrt((x - 1) ^ 2)
g(x) = (x - 1)

f(-1) = sqrt((-2) ^2) = sqrt(4) = 2
g(-1) = -2

Fitness

  • Victorian
  • Forum Obsessive
  • ***
  • Posts: 272
  • Respect: +1
Question..
« Reply #2 on: November 08, 2007, 02:42:21 pm »
0
Quote from: "reg"
Because sqrt is really +-. The full graph creates an absolute value graph, because you can't have a negative when you square something.

Wrong. You can't have sqrt(-ve number). You can have -sqrt(number). (-ve)^2 does exist as well. So I don't really see your point there ...
And it doesn't say +-, It defines it as only +...

It may say the answer is sqrt((x-1)^2) but that could be because they don't expect you to simplify? Are there any comments with that answer?
In 2006 Fitness played: IT - Processing and Management (32).
In 2007 Fitness played: English (28), Specialist Maths (25), Math Methods (32), Multimedia, Software Development (31).
In 2008 Fitness is playing: Computer and Mathematical sciences at Victoria University.

Quote from: enwiabe
Please don't ask for moderator. It will only hurt your chances.

Quote from: danieltennis
Hey guys,
How do I become a moderator?

reg

  • Guest
Question..
« Reply #3 on: November 08, 2007, 02:45:43 pm »
0
Er, excuse my poor expression perhaps, but any (-ve)^2 will be positive, which is what I meant.

It's sort of like when you take an inverse of a parabola:
y = x^2
y = sqrt(x)

You are only getting the +ve because you cannot get a negative value unless  you explicitly +- the function.

With the OP's function, you have to square and sqrt separately because the ^2 operation means only positive values will exist.

hifer

  • Victorian
  • Trendsetter
  • **
  • Posts: 110
  • Respect: 0
Question..
« Reply #4 on: November 08, 2007, 02:46:20 pm »
0
Quote from: "reg"
Because sqrt is really +-. The full graph creates an absolute value graph, because you can't have a negative when you square something.

f(x) = sqrt((x - 1) ^ 2)
g(x) = (x - 1)

f(-1) = sqrt((-2) ^2) = sqrt(4) = 2
g(-1) = -2


I've plot the graph and see ur point that it's a absolute function. the answers says u either leave it in sqrt((x-1)^2) form or |x-1| form.. How do u identify that it's an absolute function?

I played around on my calc and see that whenever there's a sqrt(x^2) eqn, it's an absolute function, is that how u identify it?

Fitness

  • Victorian
  • Forum Obsessive
  • ***
  • Posts: 272
  • Respect: +1
Question..
« Reply #5 on: November 08, 2007, 02:49:49 pm »
0
Quote from: "reg"
Er, excuse my poor expression perhaps, but any (-ve)^2 will be positive, which is what I meant.

Sorry, misread.

This is a clever question.
In 2006 Fitness played: IT - Processing and Management (32).
In 2007 Fitness played: English (28), Specialist Maths (25), Math Methods (32), Multimedia, Software Development (31).
In 2008 Fitness is playing: Computer and Mathematical sciences at Victoria University.

Quote from: enwiabe
Please don't ask for moderator. It will only hurt your chances.

Quote from: danieltennis
Hey guys,
How do I become a moderator?

kido_1

  • Victorian
  • Forum Leader
  • ****
  • Posts: 526
  • Respect: +6
Question..
« Reply #6 on: November 08, 2007, 02:50:52 pm »
0
Absolute value function can be identified when you have a sqrt (something) squared.

E.g sqrt(9x+1)squared  is equal to abs(9x+1)

This is because a square root can only produce positive real values, just like an abs function.
oping for an ENTER of 99+

reg

  • Guest
Question..
« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2007, 02:52:32 pm »
0
I dno about specific technique, but if a function exists x < 0, and x is being squared, you are losing its sign, it will be positive regardless.

With your function you can see how sqrt(x ^ 2) can only ever be positive, it's  , as you say, equal to |x|.

x on its own is equal to both the -ve and +ve values.

hifer

  • Victorian
  • Trendsetter
  • **
  • Posts: 110
  • Respect: 0
Question..
« Reply #8 on: November 08, 2007, 02:52:32 pm »
0
yup, got that now thx guys

Ninox

  • Victorian
  • Trendsetter
  • **
  • Posts: 167
  • vive le science!
  • Respect: +1
Question..
« Reply #9 on: November 08, 2007, 08:05:04 pm »
0
Quote from: "reg"
I dno about specific technique, but if a function exists x < 0, and x is being squared, you are losing its sign, it will be positive regardless.

With your function you can see how sqrt(x ^ 2) can only ever be positive, it's  , as you say, equal to |x|.

x on its own is equal to both the -ve and +ve values.


When any real number is squared it becomes positive. However, the square root of any positive number could be positive or negative. Going in the reverse again, "all real numbers" includes both positive and negative values. So (-3)^2 = (3)^2 = 9
And root(9) = +/-3

Hope that helps
2006: Engineering Studies 45 (Premier's Award), Religion and Societies 39
2007: Methods 45, Spesh 46, Chem 50, Physics 41, Literature 39, MUEP Maths 5.5
ENTER: 99.60
Science/Engineering @ Monash; Mat'ls Eng; Chem, Physiology?